I think once he gets a full year in the majors you will see his average velocity go down towards 91 a little more, he only had 90 innings in the big leagues this year and I doubt those velocity numbers carry the 90 innings he pitched in the minors so I don’t know what his average velocity was over the whole year… He could have been really pumped up in the first few starts because of his first opportunity in a while to actually stick in the majors and he wanted to make a good impression.

Just watching Clay with my own eyes he was sitting 91-93 for the most part in his starts and I don’t consider that top velocity, he isn’t going to be hitting 95 back to back to back pitches anytime soon, but by the looks of it neither will Joba.

It’s really sad that at 93.6 MPH Buchholz is over a full MPH higher on average than the “power pitcher” Joba Chamberlain with an average fastball of 92.5… That’s awful!

If I were to ask you to assign the MPH with the pitcher you would reverse those most likely in your mind.

Out of those 3 (and those do seem to be the only 3 worth signing) I have to say my first choice would be Sheets… Harden apparently has a shoulder tear and anything to do with a shoulder really scares me in a pitcher and while Bedard has always had great stuff from the left side he has always been an injury waiting to happen and from what you read he has a nasty attitude and doesn’t always try his hardest to get back on the field and pitching while hurt on a losing team he’s just not the kind of guy I want in my club house.

Clay Buchholz has a great change and a great curve and he mixes in the 4 and 2-seam fastballs to keep the hitters honest and stay off the offspeed and breaking stuff and even though he isn’t throwing much harder than 91 a good majority of the time it’s ok because his other pitches make the fastball look that much better.

Joba Chamberlain is a power pitcher who had a plus fastball with premo velocity and he used his slider and curve and change to keep the hitters honest and off of his fastball all the time.

Without plus velocity on his fastball Joba’s pitching plan breaks down, his slider loses some of the bite it had and the difference in velocity is no longer there so hitters can sit back on wait on the fastball or a hanging slider. When he doesn’t have the good velocity on the fastball his other pitches look worse.

Joba doesn’t even bring his changeup out in a game until the 4th inning or later he just doesn’t pitch he throws and because of that his lack in velocity is all the more scary…

In fact, that’s my preferred scenario.

MJ: Correct, my mistake. I briefly confused him for Lester. He’s a RHP.

I never specified what pitches of Buchholz’s I considered plus pitches. His changeup is a plus-plus offering, as is his curveball.

From Baseball America’s scouting report of Boston’s top-10 prospects in 2008:

“Buchholz has a low-90s fastball that tops out at 95 mph, and it’s his third-best pitch. His 12-to-6 curveball and his changeup both rate as 70s on the 20-80 scouting scale and are better than any on Boston’s big league staff. With terrific athleticism and hand speed, he uses an overhand delivery to launch curves that drop off the table. He’ll also mix in a handful of sliders during a game, and that’s a plus pitch for him at times.”

Actually you did

MJ:Both pitchers have plus velocity

As I stated above I don’t consider a fastball that is average 90-93 MPH to be of “plus velocity” and in face I believe it to be pedestrian from the right side… If Chamberlain can’t get his velocity up he is an average starter at best, Clay doesn’t need the plus velocity because he has such good movement and his 2-seam fastball is great. Joba on the other hand does need to the plus velocity (93-96+ MPH) in order to make his stuff special.

I didn’t say that you said his fastball was a plus pitch I was simply remarking on the fact you said his fastball has “plus velocity” which he doesn’t and at the current moment neither does Joba.

I agree that Clay has a very good change and his curve is very nasty but that doesn’t mean he has plus velocity he doesn’t… but he doesn’t need it to be good like Joba does.

I never specified what pitches of Buchholz’s I considered plus pitches. His changeup is a plus-plus offering, as is his curveball.

From Baseball America’s scouting report of Boston’s top-10 prospects in 2008:

“Buchholz has a low-90s fastball that tops out at 95 mph, and it’s his third-best pitch. His 12-to-6 curveball and his changeup both rate as 70s on the 20-80 scouting scale and are better than any on Boston’s big league staff. With terrific athleticism and hand speed, he uses an overhand delivery to launch curves that drop off the table. He’ll also mix in a handful of sliders during a game, and that’s a plus pitch for him at times.”

I think you mean that Buchholz bats left handed but he pitches right handed,

I also don’t consider 91-93 MPH being a plus fastball and in fact I consider it necessary to ordinary fastballs from both unless Joba can get back up to 93-96 MPH as a stater. If so he has plus velocity but Buchholz has much better movement on his 91-93 than Joba does and has a much much better 2-seam fastball.

Anyway, I’m not saying Buchholz has left Chamberlain in the dust or anything, just that I think Buchholz is a bit more advanced in his development than Chamberlain is and that the composite stats you cited above lack the context that I’m trying to bring.