IIATMS quoted this slightly dated article from George King that is slightly disgusting and paints a false picture of Joba Chamberlain’s history:
Another talent evaluator believes Chamberlain’s persona changed for the worse when he was converted from reliever to starter and it still affects his mechanics.
“He is a grunt-and-fart guy, he’s Joba,” the scout said. “As soon as he tries to pitch, he moves around and loses his delivery.”
Disgusting imagery aside, King seems to be suggesting that the Yankees somehow altered Joba’s natural bulldog persona by moving him from the bullpen to the rotation. The obvious issue with this interpretation is that Joba had been a starter his entire baseball life until August 2007.
The uber-prospect Chamberlain that dominated the minor leagues was a starter.
The guy throwing heat deep into minor league starts was, quite obviously, a starter.
He was not one of the top pitching prospects in baseball due to his potential as a reliever. Rather, he was selected early in the draft, was rushed through the minors, and was carefully protected by the Yankees because of his potential as a starter. He is not a reliever, and to suggest that the Yankees altered his mindset by moving him seems silly when considering his history.
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That’s all true, Moshe. Good call! Jason @ IIATMS(Quote)
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As soon as this guy finds out, he will stammer ever so slightly and with the composure of a snake oil salesman remark that it would not matter because the Yankees acclimated him to a bullpen role already.
Media idiots. Never trust the opinion of any sportswriter who a) relies on his/her own ‘instincts’ and b) never played the sport or coached or had any kind of formal training.
Statheads can paint a reasonably detailed picture of the situation, especially if they work particularly hard at what they do. But stats do not paint the entire picture. Still they are better than these Around the Horn numbnuts whose giant egos match only their giant waistlines. rightclue(Quote)
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George King gets paid to know absolutely nothing about baseball. Quite the gig. Yankee1010(Quote)
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Chris H. Reply:
October 5th, 2009 at 3:16 pm
Seriously, I want his job. Chris H.(Quote)
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The other Chris H Reply:
October 5th, 2009 at 9:05 pm
I think the assumption of a lot of “experts” is that Joba is a purely converted reliever that the Yankees wanted to experiment with a bull pen guy in the rotation. If you listen to Steve Philips do a Joba game and you would think he thinks that Joba never even started a game in his life until the Yankees decided to put him in the rotation, I just don’t get the thinking I mean these people have access to more than numbers and here say but cold hard facts and most can even talk to the players at some point and get the whole story but they still don’t try to. The other Chris H(Quote)
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Joba wants to start but mostly he wants to succeed. I think he will be lights out in relief this postseason and Gaudin will be starter #4. I also think he will come to Spring 10 in the best shape of his life and have an excellent year entirely in the rotation, the ‘rules’ just a fading bad memory. The other SteveS(Quote)
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The other Chris H Reply:
October 5th, 2009 at 9:02 pm
I really doubt they use Gaudin for the 4th starter, either way both if on the DS roster will be in the pen and then I think they will stretch Joba back out with bull pen sessions for ALCS and have Chambelrlain be the starter because they can both pitch 4 innings but only Joba has gone 7+ for the Yankees. The other Chris H(Quote)
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The other SteveS Reply:
October 6th, 2009 at 10:41 am
Gaudin has delivered lately, Joba, not so much. I could easily see Chad going 5+ followed by Ace, Joba, Phil and Mariano. It would not be an ideal situation but better than Joba getting blown out in the third. We’ll see. God, I love the playoffs. The other SteveS(Quote)
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Originally, I was for Joba as a starter but more and more, I wonder if he has the discipline to be a starter.Guy doesn’t appear to be in great shape and doesn’t have an easy delivery that generates power like Burnett does.His style is going hard, violent and maybe he’s just better suited for the Bull pen. leftylarry(Quote)
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The other Chris H Reply:
October 5th, 2009 at 11:19 pm
You can’t say he isn’t in great shape just because he is a different shape than you would like… it’s narrowed minded to think everyone’s “in shape” is the same some people are built differently than others, and I have heard your sweat statements which I think are absurd, you can’t tell if someone is in shape by how they sweat. Do you think CC is lazy because he is 300 pounds out there on the mound, Joba is at the most 250 he just carries it differently than you. The other Chris H(Quote)
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CC looks top me like he’s in shape, he’s larger but in shape for a fat guy, a big athlete, like a fotball lineman.He also has a differnt kind of family and lifestyle.I doubt you’ll see him pulled over 2 in the morning after a night of heavy drinking.Joba doesn’t look like he’s in top shape to me and his delivery doesn’t look like that of a guy who pitches 8 innings.
i was 100% for the move to starter but if the guy throws a straight 90-91-92 MPH fastball and is erratic with his breaking stuff which guys are laying off waiting for the heater where’s the upside? Leftylarry(Quote)
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The other Chris H Reply:
October 6th, 2009 at 4:49 pm
Jwas also 22 or 23 years old when that happened and although that isn’t an excuse he is still young and that is what young kids do, they act stupid. If CC was out drinking and driving it would be a much bigger deal because he is almost 30 at this point and should have his wild days for the most part behind him, and at least when he does party if he does he should be smart enough to take a driver.
I understand what you are saying about starter/reliever and if this continues next year even I the great Joba as a starter arguer may have to agree but you can’t say someone is lazy or fat or doesn’t work out or try hard when talking about athletes because you aren’t in his head. It’s just in bad taste to act as if you know what is in someones head, you have no idea what Joba’s schedule as I don’t so there is no way to know how hard he works on anything.
I still think he is protecting his arm, even when he came out of the pen the other day he threw one 96, one 95, and one 90 and a bunch of 93’s, he looked like Joba late into a game he was rolling in as a starter not his reliever form. To me that indicates he is still even in the pen protecting his arm, but if he is and he won’t stop he may have to go to the pen for that reason.
However if Joba ends up as nothing more than a reliever, I don’t believe Hughes is going to be anything more than a 90-91-92 MPH straight fastball and you could end up with nothing more than two relievers or two mediocre 4 starters in two of your biggest prospects. Suddenly the rotation going forward doesn’t look that good and you have to find another starter or two somewhere else. The other Chris H(Quote)
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I will say this though, Joba was only ever being called for in the pen to one day take over for Mariano, I really doubt he can take over as a closer if he is throwing 93 with the occasional 96, it’s just not the same as Joba in 2007 or 2008, For Chamberlain’s sake and for the rotations sake the Yankees needs to figure out Joba’s problem as a starter and fix it or he won’t be worth much more than a permanent 7th or 8th inning guy which is a huge waste of potential. The other Chris H(Quote)
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Remember why we got this guy in the first place.Scouts were afraid the violent delivery would lead to arm and shoulder problems.
Now the delivery is less violent and the heater isn’t there and the breaking stuff is easier for batters to read out of the zone.
What’s the future?
A good season before every new contract? leftylarry(Quote)
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The other Chris H Reply:
October 6th, 2009 at 7:32 pm
As I stated above if he isn’t the Joba of 07 in the pen he isn’t a great closer and if he isn’t the starter he was before the injury he isn’t anything more than a 4-5 starter, if that’s the case he is ordinary in either role and may just be that and all the hype set him up to fail, I still believe in Joba but Larry is right wonder what the future holds. The other Chris H(Quote)
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